Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby Rednal » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:28 pm

It doesn't look like their livestream was saved to Twitch. Personally, I didn't think the voices were horrible - though I admit that's mainly a matter of personal taste - but you can probably just stay on the lookout for future trailers. The game did get delayed (possibly to try and put the JP voices back in - I don't think they've specifically clarified -why- it was delayed), so there's plenty of time to look around before making your order.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby he110ne0 » Sun Feb 22, 2015 9:38 pm

Thanks so much for the info.

I have the LE preordered and I'll keep it that way until I know for sure (plenty of time to cancel, too). I hadn't heard it had gotten pushed back. I really hope they put back in the original voices and get past whatever (most likely) contract related crap is holding that back. NISA is pretty well known for upholding that & even the big devs are finally getting the message on it.

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby Rednal » Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:10 am

Yeah, they generally include dual audio unless there's literally no other choice - they know there are fans of both, after all. Unfortunately, what companies want to do for us isn't always what happens. XD;
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West: Update

Postby souledge94 » Mon Feb 23, 2015 11:36 pm

TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby lopez » Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:18 am

souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.


Personal preference. Some people believe that niche game = niche audience = niche interests, but that's not true.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West: Update

Postby TheWintendoHii » Sun Mar 08, 2015 1:39 pm

souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.

It's a niche game with an anime influence. The target demographic would be people that generally watch anime and wouldn't mind or even prefer a Japanese voice track. I do understand their thought process in including an English VA since like you said it's for an English territory, they are trying to gain the sales of your general gaming consumer. But they fail to realize this makes up a small percentage of sales. It's not worth the money to hire English VAs and risk alienating the demographic that is actually interested in these types of games.

This is my personal take on it, but just judging from current stock levels of the LE and number of people cancelling their orders, my hypothesis is probabaly correct. Personally, the game already looks pretty mediocre, mix that in with forced voice acting that try and imitate anime voice acting troupes in English, I can't justify the purchase.

But in the end, like Lopez said, it's all preference. Regardless of my reasoning, it won't change any English VA supporters' opinion on the matter and neither will mine. And yeah, I remember you from PS blog as well. This is the same thing with you with Oreshika but reversed for me. We both have our own reasons and preferences. Just like how you said you will vote with your wallet with oreshika, I'm doing the same here. The difference though, I only left one comment with my feedback for the NISA team and moved on with it. I had to comment on you on the PS blog since you just wouldn't let it go and kept griefing about the lack of an English dub option every other post. It didn't really do you any favors to be honest.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West: Update

Postby souledge94 » Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:37 am

TheWintendoHii wrote:
souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.

It's a niche game with an anime influence. The target demographic would be people that generally watch anime and wouldn't mind or even prefer a Japanese voice track. I do understand their thought process in including an English VA since like you said it's for an English territory, they are trying to gain the sales of your general gaming consumer. But they fail to realize this makes up a small percentage of sales. It's not worth the money to hire English VAs and risk alienating the demographic that is actually interested in these types of games.

This is my personal take on it, but just judging from current stock levels of the LE and number of people cancelling their orders, my hypothesis is probabaly correct. Personally, the game already looks pretty mediocre, mix that in with forced voice acting that try and imitate anime voice acting troupes in English, I can't justify the purchase.

But in the end, like Lopez said, it's all preference. Regardless of my reasoning, it won't change any English VA supporters' opinion on the matter and neither will mine. And yeah, I remember you from PS blog as well. This is the same thing with you with Oreshika but reversed for me. We both have our own reasons and preferences. Just like how you said you will vote with your wallet with oreshika, I'm doing the same here. The difference though, I only left one comment with my feedback for the NISA team and moved on with it. I had to comment on you on the PS blog since you just wouldn't let it go and kept griefing about the lack of an English dub option every other post. It didn't really do you any favors to be honest.


You do know just cause someone watches anime doesint mean they want jpn voice overs. There were people who were introduced to anime with english voice acting and prefer it that way.Theres no way you can tell people canceled their orders. the most you can go by is what people say on the message board and if anyone says they are not buying it now. Theres no real grounds on your hypothesis unless you have the sales info from nis themselves. I just personally feel if the game is coming to english speaking territories that a dub would make sense is all. Though I would always like a dual audio option if possible so noone has to miss out. Since I know that feeling and it stinks. In the oreshika thread I was just responding to post. Also I never insulted anyone for preferring jpn voice overs.

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West: Update

Postby TheWintendoHii » Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:06 am

souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:
souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.

It's a niche game with an anime influence. The target demographic would be people that generally watch anime and wouldn't mind or even prefer a Japanese voice track. I do understand their thought process in including an English VA since like you said it's for an English territory, they are trying to gain the sales of your general gaming consumer. But they fail to realize this makes up a small percentage of sales. It's not worth the money to hire English VAs and risk alienating the demographic that is actually interested in these types of games.

This is my personal take on it, but just judging from current stock levels of the LE and number of people cancelling their orders, my hypothesis is probabaly correct. Personally, the game already looks pretty mediocre, mix that in with forced voice acting that try and imitate anime voice acting troupes in English, I can't justify the purchase.

But in the end, like Lopez said, it's all preference. Regardless of my reasoning, it won't change any English VA supporters' opinion on the matter and neither will mine. And yeah, I remember you from PS blog as well. This is the same thing with you with Oreshika but reversed for me. We both have our own reasons and preferences. Just like how you said you will vote with your wallet with oreshika, I'm doing the same here. The difference though, I only left one comment with my feedback for the NISA team and moved on with it. I had to comment on you on the PS blog since you just wouldn't let it go and kept griefing about the lack of an English dub option every other post. It didn't really do you any favors to be honest.


You do know just cause someone watches anime doesint mean they want jpn voice overs. There were people who were introduced to anime with english voice acting and prefer it that way.Theres no way you can tell people canceled their orders. the most you can go by is what people say on the message board and if anyone says they are not buying it now. Theres no real grounds on your hypothesis unless you have the sales info from nis themselves. I just personally feel if the game is coming to english speaking territories that a dub would make sense is all. Though I would always like a dual audio option if possible so noone has to miss out. Since I know that feeling and it stinks. In the oreshika thread I was just responding to post. Also I never insulted anyone for preferring jpn voice overs.

Yeah, no one had actual statistics, only NISA which is why I said I'm basing it on the info we do have available. Which is the stock levels and number of people saying they are cancelling their orders here and other places.

Again, with Oreshika, even though you didn't straight out insult anybody, but your overall posts were just disgusting. Every other post was whining about how there isnt an English dub, I had to call you out on it.

Perhaps saying you want things westernized may be an insult to you, but the word is pretty accurate on what I intended. But it's more towards the localization process in general.

A lot of people, myself included just want to experience the same game released in japan minus the language barrier. That being said is why myself and others prefer the Japanese audio remains in tact and the script remains as faithful to the Japanese script as close as possible. That being said, a lot of localization companies westernized a lot of the script, NISA is also an offender of this. These localization companies takes a lot of "creative liberties" with the script that it completely changes the intended message and characters. Using Drakengard 3 as an example, the localization completely changed the main heroine, Zero's personality. The localized script has her as a foul mouthed, sex crazed bitch but her original Japanese characteristic is just an extremely sarcastic woman. This is why people prefer things to be retained as close as possible to their Japanese counterpart rather than having it Westernized with a script change and dub.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West: Update

Postby souledge94 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:06 am

TheWintendoHii wrote:
souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:
souledge94 wrote:
TheWintendoHii wrote:Its a shame that this won't get a Japanese voice track and there doesn't seem to be alternative way to include it. Sorry guys, but I won't picking this up. I'm not saying that out of spite or whatever, I want to support NISA but personally for me, a niche Japanese game like this needs a Japanese voice over option.

My personal feedback to the NISA team is to always include dual audio whenever possible, and if not, Japanese audio should always take precedence. Granted, I do understand there are those that prefer and English dub over Japanese, but I am not here to debate which one is more 'essential". This is just my personal feedback to the NISA team as a long time customer.


Why do you feel the jpn audio should always take precedence over an english dub for a game coming over to english speaking territories? I also remember you from the playstation blog.

It's a niche game with an anime influence. The target demographic would be people that generally watch anime and wouldn't mind or even prefer a Japanese voice track. I do understand their thought process in including an English VA since like you said it's for an English territory, they are trying to gain the sales of your general gaming consumer. But they fail to realize this makes up a small percentage of sales. It's not worth the money to hire English VAs and risk alienating the demographic that is actually interested in these types of games.

This is my personal take on it, but just judging from current stock levels of the LE and number of people cancelling their orders, my hypothesis is probabaly correct. Personally, the game already looks pretty mediocre, mix that in with forced voice acting that try and imitate anime voice acting troupes in English, I can't justify the purchase.

But in the end, like Lopez said, it's all preference. Regardless of my reasoning, it won't change any English VA supporters' opinion on the matter and neither will mine. And yeah, I remember you from PS blog as well. This is the same thing with you with Oreshika but reversed for me. We both have our own reasons and preferences. Just like how you said you will vote with your wallet with oreshika, I'm doing the same here. The difference though, I only left one comment with my feedback for the NISA team and moved on with it. I had to comment on you on the PS blog since you just wouldn't let it go and kept griefing about the lack of an English dub option every other post. It didn't really do you any favors to be honest.


You do know just cause someone watches anime doesint mean they want jpn voice overs. There were people who were introduced to anime with english voice acting and prefer it that way.Theres no way you can tell people canceled their orders. the most you can go by is what people say on the message board and if anyone says they are not buying it now. Theres no real grounds on your hypothesis unless you have the sales info from nis themselves. I just personally feel if the game is coming to english speaking territories that a dub would make sense is all. Though I would always like a dual audio option if possible so noone has to miss out. Since I know that feeling and it stinks. In the oreshika thread I was just responding to post. Also I never insulted anyone for preferring jpn voice overs.

Yeah, no one had actual statistics, only NISA which is why I said I'm basing it on the info we do have available. Which is the stock levels and number of people saying they are cancelling their orders here and other places.

Again, with Oreshika, even though you didn't straight out insult anybody, but your overall posts were just disgusting. Every other post was whining about how there isnt an English dub, I had to call you out on it.

Perhaps saying you want things westernized may be an insult to you, but the word is pretty accurate on what I intended. But it's more towards the localization process in general.

A lot of people, myself included just want to experience the same game released in japan minus the language barrier. That being said is why myself and others prefer the Japanese audio remains in tact and the script remains as faithful to the Japanese script as close as possible. That being said, a lot of localization companies westernized a lot of the script, NISA is also an offender of this. These localization companies takes a lot of "creative liberties" with the script that it completely changes the intended message and characters. Using Drakengard 3 as an example, the localization completely changed the main heroine, Zero's personality. The localized script has her as a foul mouthed, sex crazed bitch but her original Japanese characteristic is just an extremely sarcastic woman. This is why people prefer things to be retained as close as possible to their Japanese counterpart rather than having it Westernized with a script change and dub.


I dont get how its disgusting to call out sony for their localization process.im more understanding with smaller companies like nis and xseed who cant always afford a dub,but sony has no excuse. also being called culturally ignorant is indeed an insult. I actually liked zero,but I get if people get annoyed if they stray to much from the script. However you can have a dub and be close to the script since those do exist. As said before end of day I feel if its coming to western territories it should make sense to dub it in english not just sub it.As there are those who prefer it in english. Though the best option is always dual audio so noone has to miss out. Also the information isint valid enough to make your hypothesis seem right.

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby TheWintendoHii » Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:47 am

Like I said, its fine to give them feedback on your preferences, but the way you were going about it, griefing every other post, was not. You made it seem as if they murdered your entire family and spat on their graves.

On the PS blog and here, you questioned people why they prefer the Japanese voiceovers instead of an English dub and I think everyone has been fair in providing you with some very valid reasons. Let me ask you, why do you insist on an English dub and are completely against another language? Sure, its coming to English speaking territory but why MUST it have an English dub? Like I said, the game itself is Japanese, the medium the game is inspired from (anime) is Japanese. It makes logical sense why a Japanese voice track should be available by default.

And sure you can argue that Sony is being cheap on their release for not including an English dub but one can also argue at the same time that Sony has access to customer statistics and it shows that the majority of people playing Japanese games due in fact prefer a Japanese voice track than to an English one, so from a business standpoint, it made little to no sense to spend money to include an option that only a small percentage of the demographic will use.
And this isn't without basis either, look at all the localization companies now providing an option for Japanese audio or just leaving it in Japanese audio only. They clearly have access to customer data that we do not. Why are they starting to shift towards one end instead of another now when previously all localized games was just in English? Its a clear trend in the industry.
Might I also point out, through out all the posts for Oreshika on the PS Blog, you were the only one complaining about a lack of an English dub, I think that says something as well in regards to the majority demographic.

Also, if you are going to disagree with the points I laid out, at least have a proper counter-argument instead of just saying "it isn't valid enough". This is precisely why I didn't bother responding to your posts on the PS blog, I can clearly see, that no matter how valid the reasons people provide you, you will just end up covering your ears and disagree without a proper counter argument. You keep asking people to justify their preference to you but you have not once provided any justifiable reason why a Japanese game must have an English dub other than "its coming to an English speaking territory" and frankly, that is a very bigot reasoning in this day and age where our society is multi-cultural.
Which is why I called you out on wanting things westernized and being culturally ignorant. Which in fact, still hasn't changed as you still haven't posted anything that would say so otherwise.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby souledge94 » Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:19 pm

TheWintendoHii wrote:Like I said, its fine to give them feedback on your preferences, but the way you were going about it, griefing every other post, was not. You made it seem as if they murdered your entire family and spat on their graves.

On the PS blog and here, you questioned people why they prefer the Japanese voiceovers instead of an English dub and I think everyone has been fair in providing you with some very valid reasons. Let me ask you, why do you insist on an English dub and are completely against another language? Sure, its coming to English speaking territory but why MUST it have an English dub? Like I said, the game itself is Japanese, the medium the game is inspired from (anime) is Japanese. It makes logical sense why a Japanese voice track should be available by default.

And sure you can argue that Sony is being cheap on their release for not including an English dub but one can also argue at the same time that Sony has access to customer statistics and it shows that the majority of people playing Japanese games due in fact prefer a Japanese voice track than to an English one, so from a business standpoint, it made little to no sense to spend money to include an option that only a small percentage of the demographic will use.
And this isn't without basis either, look at all the localization companies now providing an option for Japanese audio or just leaving it in Japanese audio only. They clearly have access to customer data that we do not. Why are they starting to shift towards one end instead of another now when previously all localized games was just in English? Its a clear trend in the industry.
Might I also point out, through out all the posts for Oreshika on the PS Blog, you were the only one complaining about a lack of an English dub, I think that says something as well in regards to the majority demographic.

Also, if you are going to disagree with the points I laid out, at least have a proper counter-argument instead of just saying "it isn't valid enough". This is precisely why I didn't bother responding to your posts on the PS blog, I can clearly see, that no matter how valid the reasons people provide you, you will just end up covering your ears and disagree without a proper counter argument. You keep asking people to justify their preference to you but you have not once provided any justifiable reason why a Japanese game must have an English dub other than "its coming to an English speaking territory" and frankly, that is a very bigot reasoning in this day and age where our society is multi-cultural.
Which is why I called you out on wanting things westernized and being culturally ignorant. Which in fact, still hasn't changed as you still haven't posted anything that would say so otherwise.


All your thoughts is based off assumptions. We know companies dont put a dub because it cost money because well they have said it themselves. Even xseed has said this. Its not cause some chart they have saying more people want it sub. Its just cause if it saves them some cash or they cant afford it they will go that route. Also again it being from japan shouldint mean it should lack a dub. I mean in anime all characters speak japanese no matter where the setting is and thats cause the audience is japanese. Why cant it work the same when bringing it to english speaking territories. Having a dub doesint negatively effect the product or take you out of the world. As long as you have good actors and to be honest that goes for any product in any language. You calling me culturally ignorant is off because thats not what im doing since well heres the definition

Being unaware of the identification, importance, or relativity of a reference to what should be a well-known cultural icon, event, or activity.

I dont know how wanting a english dub and not enjoying jpn voice overs=culturally ignorant. Its not like im going to japan and complaing about the lack of english in their media or anything else. However when it comes over to where I live I would like it in english. Also please dont just toss the word bigot around just cause I want a dub. The main reason I was really annoyed about lets say freedom wars and oreshika was cause again it was sony and I expect a little more effort from a big company like them instead of cutting cost. Iv become more understanding with smaller companies since I know they dont have that kind of budget.

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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby TheWintendoHii » Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:35 pm

So.. after all that... your only justification is still just "its coming to an English-speaking territory"

You have yet to give any other reason other than, "I speak English, so it needs to be in English for me. I don't care if the game is made from another country nor do I care if the game is influenced by their nation's society and/or culture, they can't speak their language in front of me!"

That my friend, is bigotry, whether you like it or not.

And until you can come up with a better reason to justify why it NEEDS an English dub, your argument has nothing to stand on and you are simply going around in circles wasting my time.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby Rednal » Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:53 pm

Some people prefer their content in a language they understand. Others prefer the original language. There's really no right or wrong here, since it's mainly a matter of personal taste. ^^ I don't think there's any need to keep arguing about it - just recognize that companies generally do the best they can, and sometimes the circumstances mean that things don't go quite as we'd like.
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby TheWintendoHii » Wed Mar 11, 2015 7:55 pm

Rednal wrote:Some people prefer their content in a language they understand. Others prefer the original language. There's really no right or wrong here, since it's mainly a matter of personal taste. ^^ I don't think there's any need to keep arguing about it - just recognize that companies generally do the best they can, and sometimes the circumstances mean that things don't go quite as we'd like.

And that is totally understandable. Every person has his or her preferences. But when said person continuously attempts to harass people that disagree wit his point of view and also harasses the developer about not providing his preferences at each opportunity, that becomes a problem would you not agree?
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Re: Read: Important info about voice-acting for West

Postby Rednal » Wed Mar 11, 2015 8:54 pm

I only see problems when people descend to personal attacks or state that the personal preferences of others are wrong. For one, it's rude - and for two, companies are far more likely to listen when people speak in an intelligent and mature manner. If customers actually want a change in the company's operations (such as "if you can't do dual subs and can only include one track, please do X instead of Y as your default"), polite suggestions - ideally from a large group at the same time - are usually the most effective method of convincing them. Getting mad just makes hard-working employees want to ignore you - whereas being friendly (but clearly stating your preferences) actually gets them to listen.

Of course, there may also be unfortunate legal, technical, or financial issues that take the choice out of the publisher's hands. Sadly, those do crop up from time to time, and publishers tend to be as disappointed as the fans when they do appear. After all, happy customers are more likely to keep buying from them in the future, so they quite literally have a financial incentive to keep us as pleased as possible. However, I think longtime fans will usually recognize when this happens and give publishers the benefit of the doubt. If they don't do dual subs, there's usually a reason for it.
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