Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

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Sleepyprinny99
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Sleepyprinny99 » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:13 pm

I know lots of folks have mixed feelings on the decisions here over the redrawn art, but ever since confirmation that it is being redone in house...I'm weirdly excited to see what comes of it...I'm not gonna lie, I'm terrified it may turn out to be watered down US friendly crap, but that's the paranoia speaking...rationally, I don't think it'll be that bad but expectations are high...like REALLY high, especially considering the first game. It's kinda surprising tbh...

I wonder how much this tells a company about the worth of a series/venture?
General disdain for censorship aside I'm inclined to believe that folks will rage over stuff they like over just plain principles...but who knows.

@Prinny Supervisor:
Also...that vita theme...seriously, I want it.

Any chance we'll get it?

Oh yeah, you mentioned being an editor for this game...did you work on the first game?
If you did...Major props for the decent script! I'm expecting good things then!

Assuming you did work on CG 1, did you have any favorite moments/characters?
What about the second game?

Nothing spoilerlike here, just general impressions really.
Also, thanks for the honest answers and it is very appreciated.

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razisgosu
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby razisgosu » Sat Jul 16, 2016 11:15 pm

That feel when senpai ignores your question, or more accurately, it's the weekend and I'm surprised Prinny is even taking time out of his free time to maintain this thread and said question probably got lost pages back.

@Prinny -

1. Are there any plans to bring this DLC over? Either as stand alone or pre-order bonus? It's apparently this -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wr5O1XA ... e=youtu.be

2. Are there any plans to bring the theme over?

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Fenrir007 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:01 am

Hello, I just registered here for this thread. I would like to start by saying I did, in fact, read the FAQ.

The whole censorship news was quite dissapointing, especially in a time when more and more lewd japanese games are coming untouched to the west by other, more daring companies. Since I am vehemently opposed to any sort of censorship, I usually either don't buy the censored game at all or, if it is still a game that I really wanna play, I buy it used to avoid financially backing censorship laden titles.

With that said, your company is not the only one faced with this situation, and many companies went around the issue in one way or another. Some were addressed in your FAQ - like just releasing it untouched - but other weren't. I think the safest route, as well as the one that would please the biggest amount of people without going against your company policy / moral compass / rating boards would be to release the game as you are doing with censored content in the west, but working with your parent company to have the Asia release version bundled with english subtitles as many titles do. That way, if we decide to go and import it, that is our business alone, and no rating company will meddle with that transaction. The public face of the company will stay unblemished since the morally acceptable version will be the one reviewed by journalists and featured on storefronts - plus, you wont have to deal with this big backlash against censorship which grows daily.

Seriously, why not go this route? I assume you will already feature english subtitles anyway as most games released in the west have them, so the cost would be close to negligible. The fans would be pleased. As for me, this would definitely make me stop buying NISA censored games used and import them, instead. Why not do this? And the answer to this wasn't in the FAQ, by the way.

Thanks for the attention.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Battlechili » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:18 am

Prinny Supervisor wrote:
Our Japanese branch gets feedback in 3 forms: us communicating what our customers say (we often do translate feedback and let them know), them reading what customers say directly (they do have English speakers over there, and they do read reviews), and we employees communicating our feelings directly to them. Now don't misinterpret that third point by thinking that we can raise some kind of "moral objection" and have our head office bow to us, as the conspiracy theory goes. We work for them. They are the parent company. I don't want to get too into office politics or say anything unbecoming, but it helps to keep in mind that we are Nippon Ichi Software America.

And as far as a customer feedback email, I actually don't have that for you, and I'm not sure how successful it would be, really.

As someone who's relatively new to the company (and with how recently we've been pushing into Steam), I can't say for sure whether or not company policy is really up for debate. As I've stated before, I do frequently suggest to my superiors that we consider unrated games on the Steam platform.

To your second question, we are publishers, not developers, so all the programming work is done elsewhere.

While cost is a huge factor, there are others to consider. For example, the more SKUs we have, the more our logistics prinnies have to handle: things can get crazy when we're talking about multiple versions of a game in multiple packages in multiple requested quantities that have to be shipped and warehoused and sold on store shelves that request those quantities in locations around the world... You see what I mean. And of course there's the actual publishing process to consider: every version of the game has to be checked by Sony if it's going to be on a Sony platform, and trust me, it's already hard (and expensive) enough for a small team like ours. And we wouldn't want to disillusion some of our fans by giving them a different version of what fans in another part of the world got. Keeping it a single localized "game" keeps it a single vision with a single execution, so that everyone can have the same experience. That's why we tend to call the games we publish the "English" or the "localized" version, rather than the "American" version, even though most of our customers are in the US.

Thank you very much for answering some of our questions! I'm not sure that I'd feel comfortable going out and buying Criminal Girls 2 even now, but I do think I have a bit of a better understanding of the localization process involved in your games, and thus I can't be quite as upset with you guys. It does make me feel a little better that there is some level of Western customer feedback that makes its way over there, and I must thank you for many times suggesting a consideration of unrated games on Steam then; if Criminal Girls games wound up on Steam as unedited versions someday, that'd be delightful and I'd definitely give the games a purchase then.
Prinny Supervisor wrote: I understand that a popular opinion going 'round is that the original creators and artists are furious that their artistic vision is being compromised and that they're disillusioned by the whole issue, but from my experience, that is absolutely not the case. I've spoken with creators who were particular about literally every key word in a game and I've spoken with creators who only care about if the end product is fun and enjoyable, but I've never heard anyone we work with express concerns about their vision being compromised. This is probably because we work with them. The original creators are the head honchos: we don't release anything they aren't 100% satisfied with. All of their feedback, positive and negative, is taken very seriously by our team.
I will say that while I understand what you're saying here, isn't there still quite a difference between the original creators and artists actively deciding they want their game a certain way and making it that versus the original creators and artists working with a localization team to make sure the game is still agreeable in their eyes? What I mean is, if they wanted their game released in this manner, would they not also have their Japanese version be the same way? I just have a hard time seeing such changes as staying true to the original vision, even if the original developers are working with you guys on it, since these changes are being made specifically for The West, rather than because this is what they personally wanted to do.

Anyways, forgive me if its already been answered, but out of curiosity, why the skin color change here:
http://nisamerica.com/sites/default/fil ... eAfter.png
Its one of the more odd things about CG2's localization that I'm not sure I understand. Or is it just that its not finished yet?
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Dricsi07 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:36 am

I have a few question about the game and the changes surounding it(just like everyone else). This game is pretty much a fanservice game(that's not a bad thing on it's own. I played games that are way more lewd and had great story) so the changes regarding to this aspect is a big one since it's one of the main focus.

As a persone who like Japanese games and culture I always want to have the same experience in the game as the people there. Wich isn't that easy nowdays (Censoreship left and right with many game).

Anyway that's enough self pity. Let's jump in to this. I went on the youtube site for the trailler and the respond to it is extreamly negative and I can't blame them. Recently other companies(Nintendo) showed the worst posible localization work so people more than sceptical when it comes to changes. Not to mention that we get reasoning wich is good but sadly not enough. We don't know just how many of the sceens were altered and in what way.(Small adits or compleat re-drawn.) And I read above that you guys can't talk about it in depth wich is also a bit discouriging to be honest. With the new God Eater Bandai gave us a pretty in depth answer regarding the changes and it turned out to be pretty manageble. If we can get a more in depth reasoning we can understande the situation way more and it makes it easier to swallowe.

And the last thing is regarding that it's 2 wersions. If you guys would release an unmodifyed wersion in Asia or Europe with english subtitles than the whole situation can easily be awoided. Since it's not the 3ds with a region lock people can inport the game easily. For example I'm intended to inport Moechronicles trough play asia since it wasn't released here and it has english sub in asia.

I hope you guys will answer to this comment. Thank you.(I can speak english werry well but my writing always needs a bit of work.)

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby neonie » Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:38 am

Dricsi07 wrote:(I can speak english werry well but my writing always needs a bit of work.)


Are you Russian?
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Houk wrote:THE HYPOTHETICAL CENSORSHIP OF BABIES!

Spoiler:

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Ringwraith » Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:43 am

Battlechili wrote:Anyways, forgive me if its already been answered, but out of curiosity, why the skin color change here:
http://nisamerica.com/sites/default/fil ... eAfter.png
Its one of the more odd things about CG2's localization that I'm not sure I understand. Or is it just that its not finished yet?

There's a pink filter over that entire original artwork, as so it's the work in progress part that's making it different.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Dricsi07 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:26 am

neonie wrote:
Dricsi07 wrote:(I can speak english werry well but my writing always needs a bit of work.)


Are you Russian?


No I'm Hungarian.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Yuri Yuusha » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:24 am

What I don't understand is:

This game is called Criminal Girls. The premise is that the girls in question are branded as criminals (thus the title) and have been sent to Hell to be punished. The very premise of the game is that you're "punishing" doe-eyed anime girls. Once you remove that, to make way for "power distance" and all that fun stuff, then what are you left with? Who is the target audience for this game? The people who would ever buy a game like this are likely to also be the ones who get angry about censorship.

And I'm sorry to say, but the argument that the ESRB is responsible simply no longer holds water. PQube is bringing over both Valkyrie Drive and Gal*Gun: Double Peace completely uncensored, and I would say that at least VD is a lot more risque than Criminal Girls. What's more, they've publicly claimed that the ESRB is not a problem at all for games like this, and Gal*Gun got through the ratings board rather painlessly. And in case of the argument that Criminal Girls contains loli characters, Senran Kagura showed that simply removing the ages is more than enough to get past that (and it's not as if the game makes any effort to hide the fact that the girls are highschoolers). Not to mention that you can grope them, lolis and all, in the dressing room, and all but two or three (who are clearly stated to be sadistic and/or masochistic) very clearly do not consent. Yes, I have read the FAQ, but with such overwhelming precedent I find it impossible to believe that this game (or Mugen Souls) would have gotten an AO if left uncut.

The thing I'm asking is, if it's clearly not the ESRB's fault, then what is the purpose of these changes? The target audience (i.e. the people who buy games where you sexually punish cute anime girls) do not want these changes. And by removing the very thing that appeals to that audience, hell, the thing that is in the title, you're left with absolutely nothing. Why should anybody buy this game, when it doesn't have anything to sell?

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Ringwraith » Sun Jul 17, 2016 5:55 am

It's already been mentioned multiple times comparing it to Valkyrie Drive or Gal*Gun is pointless, they're actually quite different.
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<SaturnineTenshi> and we can play with solice because he likes it
<Solice> i hear it's better than playing with myself

<Solice> celtic had a hard time getting his ball out?
<Kana> oh man, you have no idea

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby shadowmaksim » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:32 am

Apologies for butting in but...

Yuri Yuusha wrote:This game is called Criminal Girls. The premise is that the girls in question are branded as criminals (thus the title) and have been sent to Hell to be punished. The very premise of the game is that you're "punishing" doe-eyed anime girls. Once you remove that, to make way for "power distance" and all that fun stuff, then what are you left with? Who is the target audience for this game? The people who would ever buy a game like this are likely to also be the ones who get angry about censorship.


Wouldn't the rest of the game suffice presumingly? I say presumingly since, again, "CG2" isn't out yet so the first game is all I have to go by.

I mean, the entire premise of the story is that the characters are being made to go through various trials where they have to fight for their lives against monsters and confront their personal demons in order to be redeemed. Wouldn't all that count as them being "punished"? The story hinges on the fact that these characters are would-be criminals and it's, again going by the first game, constantly gets brought up. Often serving as a basis for how the characters are and how they will development.

Spoiler:
Heck, in the first game, all of the characters were able to redeem themselves and stopped being "criminals" a good portion before the game even ended, around 4/5 of the way I think. So what does that say about this whole criminal complaint.


The thing I'm asking is, if it's clearly not the ESRB's fault, then what is the purpose of these changes? The target audience (i.e. the people who buy games where you sexually punish cute anime girls) do not want these changes. And by removing the very thing that appeals to that audience, hell, the thing that is in the title, you're left with absolutely nothing. Why should anybody buy this game, when it doesn't have anything to sell?


I know I've stated this before but it really does feel like people think that the minigame is all there is to the game, or at the very least the only thing that remotely matters.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Rednal » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:42 am

Yup. The minigame was maybe... 5% of my playtime in the first Criminal Girls, or a bit less? And I enjoyed the rest of the game more than I did the Motivation parts.
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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby RandomR » Sun Jul 17, 2016 9:53 am

shadowmaksim wrote:I know I've stated this before but it really does feel like people think that the minigame is all there is to the game, or at the very least the only thing that remotely matters.

No people are just complaining about it because it's what is getting changed.

Rednal wrote:Yup. The minigame was maybe... 5% of my playtime in the first Criminal Girls, or a bit less? And I enjoyed the rest of the game more than I did the Motivation parts.

And other people might have different opinions and not like that 5% of their playthough was changed, good for you that you didn't mind.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Dricsi07 » Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:42 pm

Rednal wrote:Yup. The minigame was maybe... 5% of my playtime in the first Criminal Girls, or a bit less? And I enjoyed the rest of the game more than I did the Motivation parts.

Sorry for buting in but If they would remove it compleatly than I wouldn't buy the game right of the bat. I would inport the japanese wersion instead.

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Re: Criminal Girls 2 is heading your way!

Postby Rednal » Sun Jul 17, 2016 1:18 pm

@RandomR: Of course they might have different opinions. *Blinks* And there's no problem with that. The point is to have fun, after all, and I'd be a pretty nasty sort of person if I tried to tell other people how to do that. :lol:

@Dricsi: You're not butting in - by all means, feel free to express your opinions and let companies know what parts of the game you're most interested in. They want to sell stuff to you, after all, and knowing what convinces you to make a purchase helps both of you. ^^
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