Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

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Seventh
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:28 am

ZekeFreek wrote:
Spoiler:
3. Everyone addresses eachother by first name. (Aside from one character for plot-reasons)
-This is my bigger issue. If you have any inkling of how the Japanese language works and have heard the JP voice acting, you'll know why this is an issue. Having everyone call eachother by first name makes the whole cast seems a LOT closer than they are actually supposed to be. In my mind, this changes the perception of their relationships and by extent, alters characterization. Which is a big no-no.
4. Absence of suffixes.
-A related point to #3. Now NISA does this all the time, but it is especially egregious here. Getting rid of suffixes in a Disgaea game doesn't bother me in the least. But Danganronpa is a story full of Japanese characters in a Japanese setting. Along with the above point, the absence of name suffixes alters the perception of the character's relations to anyone who knows anything about Japanese culture. There is a BIG difference between "Kirigiri-san" and simply "Kyoko". Again, other localization companies understand this, so NISA doesn't have much of an excuse.

I was honestly shocked when I first heard NISA was going to be the company to bring this game over. It didn't seem like it fit them, and I think even they'll admit that Danganronpa is a bit outside their norm. NISA has a particular style of localization that works for the games they usually bring over, the Disgaeas, the Neptunias, etc. But when dealing with a more... grounded story that has actual Japanese culture in it, that style no longer works. It's a poor fit. A mis-match. It only serves to highlight all the problems I personally have with their style of localization and shows how stubborn and cowardly they can be by ignoring knowledge that most of their audience has.

Yeah, I'm barely into Chapter 1 (or maybe not, I have no idea how long chapters are yet) and this is really bugging me. I can normally ignore this kind of thing when games are fully voiced - hey, turn on the Japanese dialogue and you're set - but this isn't even close to fully voiced, so huge chunks of characterization have been changed and there's no way to know what's been lost here.

There's trying to make your game available to everyone, but then there's alienating some of your actual target audience too.
Last edited by Seventh on Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby ZekeFreek » Wed Feb 19, 2014 12:40 pm

NISA needs to understand that when you bring over a niche otaku game, most of your audience is going be niche otaku. Thus it is perfectly acceptable and even preferred to assume the player has a decent or even just minimal understanding of Japanese culture.

Again, other localization companies understand this.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Houk » Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:12 pm

ZekeFreek wrote:NISA needs to understand that when you bring over a niche otaku game, most of your audience is going be niche otaku. Thus it is perfectly acceptable and even preferred to assume the player has a decent or even just minimal understanding of Japanese culture.

Again, other localization companies understand this.


Or we actually do have a pretty good understanding of our users and our products, which has led to consistent success in the marketplace.

You know, either/or.

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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:51 pm

Can I just point out that just because a product sells doesn't necessarily mean the localization was perfect?

I don't mean to start anything, but I just find that logic inherently flawed because to be able to have a complaint in the first place, you will (probably) have purchased the game. Therefore, even if you hate the localization with every fiber of your being, as far as the localization company is concerned, you liked it.

I'm not saying anything one way or the other in regards to what other people think or like, just that "our games are selling therefore there isn't a problem" doesn't make sense to me when a consumer can't know about these things until they've actually bought the game. It also doesn't take into account how the consumer might be choosing to put up with things they may dislike about a localization for other reasons (the issue is minor, the gameplay makes it worth it, and so on), and it certainly doesn't take ignorance into account - if some consumers don't know about something in the first place, of course it won't bother them, or worse, they'll think the source material was always like that (for example, all the wrong impressions people have about Neptunia characters thanks to localization choices).

It's also, honestly, really off putting to see valid points (no matter how well or poorly worded) continuously brushed off with this reasoning.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Beedlebud » Wed Feb 19, 2014 2:58 pm

The general positive reception of the game tells me that both of your opinions are pretty much in the minority. As Houk says, they know what they're doing. If they didn't, this market would've reflected that by the game bombing.

Can I just point out that just because a product sells doesn't necessarily mean the localization was perfect?


I don't think anyone said this.

It's also, honestly, really off putting to see valid points (no matter how well or poorly worded) continuously brushed off with this reasoning.


Or it could just be that people don't care about the "changes" nearly as much as you think do. What you may think is "wrong" may be of little consequence, or not even a problem for someone else. I wish you two wouldn't act like your opinion is the same as everyone else's, like you're standing up to the man and NISA's some villain corporation or something.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:23 pm

Just to clarify:

I'm not saying anything one way or the other in regards to what other people think or like


My first comment was prefaced with "this bugs me," so I'm just speaking for myself. I did say that at the end of it it might alienate a portion of the target audience, but that didn't edit right so I'll fix that in a moment to reflect what I meant.

Anyhoo, I'm not trying to fight the man or speak for everyone. I'm speaking for myself and solely for myself, which I have the right to do. My second reply was a general comment in response to Houk's comment (though it applies to yours as well), not specifically this situation, which I've seen Houk use a lot whenever criticism comes up. Further, even if you don't think a point is valid, that doesn't necessarily make it less valid. I'm not going to pretend to speak for everyone, but I am going to speak for myself, as I have the right to do.

And hell, I think it's, in the grand scheme of things, a minor complaint, but it's still a valid one and it's still one that's bugging me, so I'm merely expressing that.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Beedlebud » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:30 pm

Seventh wrote:Just to clarify:

I'm not saying anything one way or the other in regards to what other people think or like


My first comment was prefaced with "this bugs me," so I'm just speaking for myself. I did say that at the end of it it might alienate a portion of the target audience, but that didn't edit right so I'll fix that in a moment to reflect what I meant.

Anyhoo, I'm not trying to fight the man or speak for everyone. I'm speaking for myself and solely for myself, which I have the right to do. My second reply was a general comment in response to Houk's comment (though it applies to yours as well), not specifically this situation, which I've seen Houk use a lot whenever criticism comes up. Further, even if you don't think a point is valid, that doesn't necessarily make it less valid. I'm not going to pretend to speak for everyone, but I am going to speak for myself, as I have the right to do.

And hell, I think it's, in the grand scheme of things, a minor complaint, but it's still a valid one and it's still one that's bugging me, so I'm merely expressing that.


The way you've expressed this complaint multiple times tells me that it's not a minor complaint for you. I just feel like you're trying to make this complaint objective when it's a very subjective thing.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Shizuka » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:32 pm

What Zeke and Seventh mentioned did bother me while playing NISA's Danganronpa, it didn't drastically affect my opinion about the overall localization. It's just one of the few things that bothered me, among lots of reasons it pleased me.

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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:36 pm

@Beedle
... What?

This is the first time I've commented on this subject though. Only one of my posts has been about it (the one at the top of this page). I mean I hadn't even started the game until this afternoon, so I have no idea what you're talking about.

@Shiz
This basically sums it up. I'm thoroughly enjoying the game, and as I said, it's overall a minor gripe, but it's a gripe all the same.

I did get thrown for a loop at Ultimate Fanfic Creator but I honestly have no idea what else they could have used.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Beedlebud » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:42 pm

Seventh wrote:Yikes. The others are fine, but the bit from the Hardcore Gamer review is seriously making me want to go right to Gamestop tomorrow and cancel my preorder.


+the SHSL thread.

You didn't mention anything real specific about the translation until now, but you've been saying stuff like this for awhile now.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:46 pm

And Houk responded, convincing me I would have been making a bad decision. He was right too.

In any case, that's completely unrelated to this issue (the bit about how the names were dealt with) and I don't see why it needs to be brought back up.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Beedlebud » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:48 pm

Seventh wrote:And Houk responded, convincing me I would have been making a bad decision. He was right too.

In any case, that's completely unrelated to this issue (the bit about how the names were dealt with) and I don't see why it needs to be brought back up.


Translation issues are unrelated to other translation issues?
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 3:53 pm

I guess not if you want to be broad about it like that. :?

I just didn't realize we were in a "no opinions allowed" area of the forum. Sorry.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Beedlebud » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:10 pm

Seventh wrote:I guess not if you want to be broad about it like that. :?

I just didn't realize we were in a "no opinions allowed" area of the forum. Sorry.


That wasn't my intention. Sorry if you feel that way, I just don't like it when you try to present your opinion as if it must be how everyone feels, also as if NISA has some obligation to fix it just because you want them to.
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Re: Dangan Ronpa Review Thread

Postby Seventh » Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:24 pm

Okay, um. Not that an opinion should need to be clarified as such, since that's implied, but:

Seventh wrote:Just to clarify:

I'm not saying anything one way or the other in regards to what other people think or like


My first comment was prefaced with "this bugs me," so I'm just speaking for myself. I did say that at the end of it it might alienate a portion of the target audience, but that didn't edit right so I'll fix that in a moment to reflect what I meant.

Anyhoo, I'm not trying to fight the man or speak for everyone. I'm speaking for myself and solely for myself, which I have the right to do.


Honestly I'm not sure how much clearer than that I could have been. I'm sorry you got that impression, I am, but I didn't do that.
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