Fairy Fencer English Cast

Official forum of this turn-based RPG for the PS3
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Porecomesis
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Porecomesis » Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:45 pm

Magician_Type_0 wrote:I'm mind boggled at Effole's name change, not because it doesn't make sense since it does, but it's also a name I associate with grandmothers. :/

Ho ho hold the hell up.

What's this about Effole's name change?

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Kayo Police » Tue Apr 08, 2014 2:16 am

Porecomesis wrote:
Magician_Type_0 wrote:I'm mind boggled at Effole's name change, not because it doesn't make sense since it does, but it's also a name I associate with grandmothers. :/

Ho ho hold the hell up.

What's this about Effole's name change?


It's Ethel now.... E-T-H-E-L

You have my condolences


Back on topic tho:

The_Dood_Abides wrote:
NEET_GAMER wrote:
The_Dood_Abides wrote:I'm not sure I understand the metric you're using, but a decent chunk of the game will be fully voiced.


I believe he's meaning how much of the main story will be voiced.


Ah, that makes sense. In that case, I can say that all the events in-game that directly pertain to the main story are fully voiced.


That does not really instill much confidence from me honestly, I don't know the criteria that NISA decided to use for a scene to qualify as a "Main Story Event" is it just the subject matter of the conservation? the people involved in the scene? What if a scene decides to go from silly/stupid to vaguely plot related? Does that fit into the directly pertaining to the Main Story criteria as well?

There is just too much leeway that I can NISA making use of honestly. Yes I completely understand you did not say only the main story events are voiced. But that is vague as well, you can voice a couple of silly side scenes and still have that count as Main Story + Some Stuff voiced.
After seeing how NISA mishandle the HDN series after a great 1st localization it has just left me with an extremely bitter point of view of NISA and how they manage each games' localization that isn't Disgaea #4592821236: We're back again the sequel
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby NEET_GAMER » Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:53 am

What next,

Tiara's name being changed to Tina? :?

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Porecomesis » Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:59 am

Kayo Police wrote:
Porecomesis wrote:
Magician_Type_0 wrote:I'm mind boggled at Effole's name change, not because it doesn't make sense since it does, but it's also a name I associate with grandmothers. :/

Ho ho hold the hell up.

What's this about Effole's name change?

It's Ethel now.... E-T-H-E-L

You have my condolences

... What was wrong with Effole? I sort of see the logic behind Alyn and Eryn but... what was wrong with Effole?

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:21 am

Kayo_Police wrote:After seeing how NISA mishandle the HDN series after a great 1st localization it has just left me with an extremely bitter point of view of NISA and how they manage each games' localization that isn't Disgaea #4592821236: We're back again the sequel

Isn't that partially because Disgaeas are A: N1's main series and B: Don't typically have as much text as V did?

I'm not sure it's fair to say they're mishandling it if they're doing the same amount of work as they did in the first game, which you yourself claim was great.

That aside... Ethel? Really? :?
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Excelsia » Tue Apr 08, 2014 7:34 am

Porecomesis wrote:
Kayo Police wrote:You have my condolences

... What was wrong with Effole? I sort of see the logic behind Alyn and Eryn but... what was wrong with Effole?

I kind of have to agree with Pore, here. Truth be told, I actually rather liked the name 'Effole'.
Perhaps I'm just being silly, but 'Ethel' just really doesn't seem to fit her at all.

I'd be interested in knowing what grounds this particular name change was based upon.

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 7:43 am

If nothing else, the spelling could have changed to make it more "appropriate" if that was the problem.
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby The_Dood_Abides » Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:29 am

So the reasoning behind changing Effole to Ethel is as follows:

In Japanese, Effole has one pronunciation: Eff-oh-ruu. Pretty straightforward. But this name does not exist in English, so when you apply the conventions of spoken English to that name exactly as it's spelled, there are many different ways this name can be pronounced depending on which syllable is stressed (EFF-ole vs. eff-OLE) and the acoustics of the vowels in the name (AY-fole, EEE-fole, eff-OOL, etc.).

Now I believe the most natural sounding version of the name is EFF-ole, and if this game had no voice acting at all, I would've left the name as it's spelled and let the player's imagination determine how the name should be pronounced. Case in point, Sabin in FF3 (FF6 in Japan) can be pronounced SAY-bin, Sa-BEENE, SAHB-in and these pronunciations are all technically correct because there's no standardized pronunciation that the characters are expected to adhere to in-game, so the player gets to dictate for themselves how they think this name is pronounced.

(I know that Sabin's name in FF3 is actually the result of a localization change, and that in FF6 he's actually called Mash, but work with me here.)

But because this name doesn't exist in English, and this game has voice acting, and multiple characters say her name throughout various scenes, it quickly became apparent that the most natural sounding version of this name (EFF-ole) still felt and sounded unnatural when spoken aloud in English. In fact, it pretty much sounded like the name Ethel if it were spoken with a harsh lisp, which I felt distracted from the scenes in which her name is openly mentioned. So for ease and consistency of pronunciation across the various voice actors who were required to say this name, I made the call to split the difference and just have her be called Ethel outright. It's phonetically similar to her original name, it's a common enough name among English-speakers that the pronunciation is more or less universal, and it doesn't have the distracting lispy tic that I mentioned earlier.

To be honest, I kind of expected that this change would be met with a mixed reaction. This sort of snag when it comes to localizing names is fairly common, and when it happens, it's my job to work with my translator partner and make a decision that I feel is in the best interest of the finalized product. You don't have to agree with my reasoning or like the decision I've made, but I hope that my explanation provides a greater understanding and insight into how decisions like this are made, and that they're not made lightly but rather after serious thought has been put into it. Rest assured, just because her name is Ethel rather than Effole does not mean that the qualities that are actually fundamental to her characterization have been changed. She's still the menacing, soft-spoken, adorable assassin in our localization that she was in the original Japanese. She just goes by Ethel now.

I really don't want to this thread to degenerate into complaints about the name change, so let's stay on topic from this point forward. If you still want to discuss this matter with me, you're more than welcome to PM me with questions that my explanation perhaps did not address.
Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:35 am

Can we make a topic to talk about this kind of thing then? Having a "take it where no one else can see or talk about it amongst themselves" policy doesn't seem like a policy that'll make everyone happy either, you know?
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby The_Dood_Abides » Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:53 am

Seventh wrote:Can we make a topic to talk about this kind of thing then? Having a "take it where no one else can see or talk about it amongst themselves" policy doesn't seem like a policy that'll make everyone happy either, you know?


Someone already made the thread you described, and the first post was loaded with unnecessary vitriol and spurious accusations about NISA having some nefarious "agenda" behind decisions like this, so I locked it. Given some of the personalities on this forum, I really don't have high hopes that a thread devoted to such a touchy issue will remain civil. Addressing it on a case-by-case basis like I'm doing now seems to work best for all parties involved.

That's not to say that you can't make a thread to talk among yourselves about this, but if things get heated and inappropriate, I have no reservations about locking it like I did the previous thread. Using these forums is a privilege, not a right, and there's a certain level of decorum I expect from our users. So basically, make the thread if you want, but we'll be watching it closely.

As far as Ethel's concerned, I've explained the reasoning behind the change as best as I can. If that explanation failed to address a specific question or concern, you're better off PMing me than starting a a whole new thread or continuing the conversation here where it would be off-topic.
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:00 am

Uh, wait, unless it was flat out deleted, the only thread I'm seeing locked is the one on censorship, which is a decidedly different animal than other localization choices I would think.

I think there's no harm in discussion if it's civil though, so I'll go make a thread I guess.
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Beedlebud » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:04 am

Seventh wrote:Uh, wait, unless it was flat out deleted, the only thread I'm seeing locked is the one on censorship, which is a decidedly different animal than other localization choices I would think.

I think there's no harm in discussion if it's civil though, so I'll go make a thread I guess.


It's the first thread in the Feedback forum.
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:17 am

Ah, so it is. I figured it'd be here.

Well, I made the thread - complete with hopefully enough to keep it civil, but we'll see - so now we can get back to talking voices here.
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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Houk » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:50 am

Kayo Police wrote:That does not really instill much confidence from me honestly, I don't know the criteria that NISA decided to use for a scene to qualify as a "Main Story Event" is it just the subject matter of the conservation? the people involved in the scene? What if a scene decides to go from silly/stupid to vaguely plot related? Does that fit into the directly pertaining to the Main Story criteria as well?

There is just too much leeway that I can NISA making use of honestly. Yes I completely understand you did not say only the main story events are voiced. But that is vague as well, you can voice a couple of silly side scenes and still have that count as Main Story + Some Stuff voiced.
After seeing how NISA mishandle the HDN series after a great 1st localization it has just left me with an extremely bitter point of view of NISA and how they manage each games' localization that isn't Disgaea #4592821236: We're back again the sequel


The game's script is specifically divided up into "main story" scenes and "side story" scenes. That's not related to the localization, it's just how the developer divided up the story on their end. The main story was short enough that we were able to fit most (or all?) of those lines into our voice budget, along with standard battle and system lines. So it's not us arbitrarily deciding which scenes are "main" and which are "side" - it's us following the system according to the developer.

Of course, there are times on projects where we can't voice ALL of the main event scenes, and in those cases we do have to prioritize which scenes are most important based on content, character involvement, location in the story, etc.

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Re: Fairy Fencer English Cast

Postby Seventh » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:54 am

Sounds like my concerns about game length were on the money then. :(

May I ask how the side stuff works? Like, are they things you need to seek out, or are they just events that take place during the game but are unrelated to the overall/main plot? Like, say, skits in a Tales game or maybe a cutscene in which some characters make fun of another character'd fear of women or something.
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